RoxHard said on January 26, 2005 05:07:

http://www.wusatv9.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=36555

“Change Is Possible”
That’s the message behind a controversial new billboard in Montgomery County. It’s controversial because it claims gays can choose to become straight.

Nancy Yamada’s Report

Next to the photo of a smiling man, the towering billboard along Hungerford drive reads “ex gays prove that change is possible”.

Sponsored by the Virginia based parents and friends of ex-gays and gays, the message is that homosexuals can choose to become heterosexual.

“My life is definitely living proof that change is possible” says Melissa Coffey.

Coffey, who lives in Alexandria says she was in a lesbian relationship in college. When it ended, she realized she didn’t want to be gay. “Something wasn’t right” says Coffey.

She turned to her church for guidance. Six years later, she runs an organization that in her words, helps people “overcome” homosexuality.

“I work with men and women everyday who are changing their sexuality …there is no scientific proof that homosexuality is genetic...if you look at all the studies...nothing has been proven” says Coffey.

But from his office in Silver Spring, Maryland, Dan Furmansky the Executive Director of Equality Maryland strongly disagrees.

“Most people I know who are gay and lesbian don’t feel it’s a choice”

He fears this billboard sends a dangerous message, especially to kids. “I certainly don’t disparage their right, which is a difficult one for them”

As for Coffey, she says she’s happier than ever. “I’m ready to settle down and get married that’s for sure”

Until last fall, this billboard was displayed in Richmond, Virginia. From here we’re told it will be moved to other states around the country, no doubt, prompting more controversy and debate

Jud (moderator) said on January 26, 2005 08:04:

haha, and how many gay have had straight relationships during school time!! Wait, they are actually straight who chose to become gay. Let’s get a billboard aimed at “converting” straight :D

Some people are funny :D

pumpkins said on January 26, 2005 09:05:

i do not believe that gay peoples make a conchious decision to be gay but i do not believe that they are born that way either. the majority of gay people have been abused either sexually physically or mentally. the majority of gay men do never have had a good relationship to there dads. gay peoples get very angry all the time at straight peoples. being gay is not natural. that is why they are always on the defensive.

antz said on January 26, 2005 10:15:

*applause* (to cabon boy)

pumpkins said on January 26, 2005 10:46:

carbon boy. i don’t think i am narrow mided or brainwashed. i can only be true to what i know and believe. why do you want me to change my views and my opinion to fit in with yours. you are a perfect example of the anger i mentioned and have seen in the homosexual peoples i know. if you want me to accept your views then please have the serenity to accept mine. thank you.

carbon_boy said on January 26, 2005 13:19:

@pumpkins: Every so-called belief in this world exists purely because it was taught to its followers. Open-mindedness only exists therefore if you can step back and look at the world around you, think for yourself, forget about what you have learnt from your priests, teachers, friends, etc and make your OWN decisions and create your own beliefs as such.

To your comment about my anger, all I can say is: would you just sit back and smile if someone made uninformed comments on your religion, colour of your skin or on your nationality? I think not. It’s hard when people lash out left, right and centre on a subject that is such a big factor in ones life. Not?

And about the fact that I only mentioned sexual abuse is just because I’ve heard that old story so many times its actually sickening. Love and sex goes hand in hand. I’ve heard more stories about women and/or men that get married, love their hetero partner but can’t have sex with because of sexual abuse, than of people “turning” gay. I’m, sorry my dear Pumpkin, you can’t CHANGE your sexual orientation. You just ARE. Oh, and how does mental and physical abuse change your sexual orientation? Maybe it’s cos I’ve never experienced any of the 3 that I can’t comment on it.

I think if this world only realised that the person on the other side of their computers, on the other side of the battle field or on the other side of the planet is also a PERSON, with FEELINGS and just as many problems as them, THEN MAYBE this would be a better world and things like what this topic is about and the comments you have made would NEVER happen.

Cheers

carbon_boy said on January 26, 2005 13:54:

@ Pumpkins: No worries. I’m just glad you understand where I’m coming from - and other guys/girls like me. I’m not trying to change your views. I’m merely trying to explain to you that homosexuality is as much part of us as the colour of your skin. And there really is NOTHING we can do about it.

So rather just tolerate and forget about the “why’s” and “howcomes”. That’s all we ask for.

Thanx

pumpkins said on January 26, 2005 17:46:

this is well known. it has been raised in a number of studies.

Jud (moderator) said on January 26, 2005 19:00:

yeah, i’m with you, never been abused in whatever way. I only understood some things from my childhood/teenager time when I accepted my homosexuality, so I surely never chose to be gay.

What are those studies you refer to? I guess you have informed yourself well and also read the other studies that tell homosexuality is not a choice?

Jud (moderator) said on January 27, 2005 07:17:

That’s why I ask pumkin if he read the other studies too, but I am sure he has as he seems to be extremely informed. One has to always listen to the 2 sides of the story in order to make a good judgement, or? ;)

That’s the same non-sense that a child brought up by two mums or dads is likely to become gay too - that’s one of the points when objecting adoption by gay couples. By the same rule, how the hell would gay exist then? If gay parents bring up gay children... shouldn’t straight parents bring up straight children? ;)

kachina008 said on January 27, 2005 09:46:

hehe what a great discussion.
I don’t understand why what a person does in the privacy of his home is up for discussions.

Pumpkins if you “don’t believe” something, how can you accept it? woud you have a gay friend? what if you became really close to someone, only to find out he/she was gay? would you break off the friendship?

carbon_boy: great comments. I wonder how many true gay people aer out there who acutally advocate this “conversion” to straightness. It’s like men against abortion.

pumpkins said on January 27, 2005 10:29:

i have homosexual friends and i do not disown them. and yes they have been abused when they were young children. not all sexually. one of them , there are 3, came out to tell peoples he is homosexual four months ago. he was manly and behaved normal but now since he tells peoples, he behaves and speaks like a girl and he is annoying us. he never behaved in this way before. those studies are not as old as you seem to think they are. i understand those of you who are homosexual disagreeing with me. that is your right but i also think that you have to justify what never was and never will be a natural act. why do you get angry with religious so much? it is because religious are the only one with the braveness to tell you the things you do are wrong. i don’t care what you do or who you love.i don’t even find it interesting. you are homosexual, so what. that is nothing special.but why do you think you have to change my mind on this thing? i would understand it if i were hating you or beating you but i am not.

carbon_boy said on January 27, 2005 14:10:

@pumpkins: The guy that came out and is acting flamboyant is just going through a stage - which is nothing new eithre. I’ve seen tons of guys coming out of the closet. Really butch guys that suddenly start squeeling and acting like girls. They have a misconception that all gay guys act/should act like women, or should be flamboyant. Barf. My take on it: just be comfortable with what you are and just be yourself and not someone or something else.

And concerning the fact that you think I am /we are disagreeing with you, well, I/we have that right - and more so, cos I/we know more about being gay than you and the countless studies will EVER know. And yes, those studies on gay people are old. The latest studies as you should know, have gone biological because psychological studies have been dumped in the bin where they belong.

”...i also think that you have to justify what never was and never will be a natural act.”

Maybe not for you, but is for me and many other people. Heterosexual sex to me is unnatural. I have no interest in it whatsoever, just as you have no interest in homosexual sex.

”...why do you get angry with religious so much? it is because religious are the only one with the braveness to tell you the things you do are wrong.”

I dont have a problem with what the Christian bible teaches us. I do however have a problem with organised religion. For organised religion not only judge gay people, but also everything else that could bring their whole set belief system to the ground. The churches favourite quote from the bible (and only one of 3 where gay people are mentioned) is 1 Corinthians 6 verses 9-10: http://www.nccbuscc.org/nab/bible/1corinthians/1corinthians6.htm

BUT HOWEVER. read one verse further and the whole story changes....

And I quote verses 9-11: Do you not know that the unjust will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators nor idolaters nor adulterers nor boy prostitutes nor sodomites nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God. That is what some of you used to be; but now you have had yourselves washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

Yes, I have a problem with the Church. As I understand it: God created all of us. So who are YOU and the CHURCH to judge us?

“I don’t care what you do or who you love.i don’t even find it interesting. you are homosexual, so what. that is nothing special.but why do you think you have to change my mind on this thing? i would understand it if i were hating you or beating you but i am not.”

I loved this bit! How hypocritical of you! You say you don’t care about homosexuals, etc - so why if it’s not interesting, nothing special, means nothing to you, etc do you have an opinion on it and you’ve supposedly read up on it?

The fact is you can’t deal with the fact that there are people out there that are different to you. So, thanx for saying something on this topic, cos hopefully you or/and others had a bit of an education now.

Cheers

StillFar said on January 27, 2005 15:08:

definition of natural (now if you had some form of education besides the religious one, you should know that many animals show homosexual behaviour and you should also know that they do not have the power to take a decision as we have...I think there are even some queer pumpkins):

adj 1: in accordance with nature; relating to or concerning nature;
“a very natural development”; “our natural
environment”; “natural science”; “natural resources”;
“natural cliffs”; “natural phenomena” [ant: unnatural]
2: existing in or produced by nature; not artificial or
imitation; “a natural pearl”; “natural gas”; “natural
silk”; “natural blonde hair”; “a natural sweetener”;
“natural fertilizers” [ant: artificial]
3: existing in or in conformity with nature or the observable
world; neither supernatural nor magical; “a perfectly
natural explanation” [ant: supernatural]
4: (biology) functioning or occurring in a normal way; lacking
abnormalities or deficiencies; “it’s the natural thing to
happen”; “natural immunity”; “a grandparent’s natural
affection for a grandchild”
5: (music) of a key containing no sharps or flats; “B natural”
[ant: sharp, flat]
6: unthinking; prompted by (or as if by) instinct; “a cat’s
natural aversion to water”; “offering to help was as
instinctive as breathing” [syn: instinctive]
7: (used especially of commodities) in the natural unprocessed
condition; “natural yogurt”; “natural produce”; “raw
wool”; “raw sugar”; “bales of rude cotton” [syn: raw,
rude]
8: related by blood; not adopted; “natural parent”
9: being talented through inherited qualities; “a natural
leader”; “a born musician”; “an innate talent” [syn: born,
innate]
10: unaffected and natural looking; “a lifelike pose”; “a
natural reaction” [syn: lifelike]
n 1: someone regarded as certain to succeed; “he’s a natural for
the job”
2: a notation cancelling a previous sharp or flat [syn: cancel]
3: (in craps) a first roll of 7 or 11 that immediately wins the
stake

Jud (moderator) said on January 28, 2005 06:28:

So if you don’t mind what gay do or do not, you aren’t interested in it, why are you actually making all possible in order to make gay second class citizens?

I certainly have nothing against beliefs, everybody believes in something, what I don’t like are organised religions that only mind about controling the others below them. I personally wouldn’t like anybody to tell me how I have to live my life and how I have to feel whenever I do something.

If you want to believe Mary got pregnant just like that, fine with me, but would you like it if I would go around telling AND trying to push that to a law that christian people are plain stupid and can’t have certain jobs that require a high IQ, do I?

Btw, you haven’t said anything about the other studies that tell homosexuality is just another caracteristic of a person such as having blue eyes or dark skin. What do you think of those? Or maybe you have no clue what I am talking about? And what do you think about evolution? It never happened right?

pumpkins said on January 28, 2005 09:23:

now i am very tired of this childish excahnge of empty and childish words. i still feel i am talking to children. angry children who refuse to accept it is bedtime and are trying very hard to find arguments or reasons why they should not go to bed.

you are all so angry with religious. where have i said i am religious?

judith i get the feeling from you that you are a cold person. i feel sorry for you if that is so but you sound very young so i think you can change. to make a statemnt that says religious peoples have a low IQ unforunately tells a lot about your IQ.

i am now no longer interested in this topic. if you thought to change my opinion on this issue you have failed. you have only made me more sure of what i believe. there is a few things you gay peoples have in common. things like being very childish. this would maybe be becuase of your sexual im maturity. i don’t know. you are all so angry. none of you seem to be able to accept others opinion yet you demand that others accept your and also change theres to yours.

i do not care what the churches say about anything. most of the time i do not know what they are saying. but you are all so angry with religious peoples. i know it is because they do not think as you do. accept this with serenity. allow them to believe as they do. if you can get rid of all that anger you will live happyer lifes.

maybe it is the brainwashed way you present your selfs and the anger you have that turns peoples away and put them off. i love my homo friends but they show these things in their character also. we have talked to them about this but they answer with the same rehearsed things that you do.

now i really am tired of this topic because it is just saying the same thin all the time.

coyboyusa said on January 28, 2005 10:05:

pumpkin is oldag75 or beautyqueen i was comparing their posts last night they are the same person i am no longer replying to pumpins threads guys

Oldag75 said on January 28, 2005 13:04:

No, pumpkin is not Oldag. I haven’t commented on this subject. The basic premise – a billboard campaign to “convert” a homosexual to heterosexuality – is so absurd that any discussion stemming therefrom is doomed to be even more ridiculous (though some has been enjoyable).

Some people engage in homosexual behavior by choice, but I think genuine homosexuality results from biological processes during fetal development. Meaning that you can buy all the billboard space in the world, but you’re not really going to convert a person whose fundamental fabric is woven that way.

Oh sure, there are people who say there’s no proof that homosexuality is biological... and, at the same time, I’ve heard a couple of folks actually say there’s no “rock-solid” proof that HIV causes AIDS. (So, please show me someone with AIDS who isn’t HIV positive?) My belief that homosexuality is biological extends from a series of articles about sexuality in Playboy during the early 1980s, along with plain old observation of people. It was damned obvious in the first grade, at age six, that Stanley was effeminate to his bone marrow – a gay child who grew into a gay man. A “choice” of that nature definitely isn’t made at age six. It was made in the womb.

Anarem said on January 29, 2005 00:37:

@pumpkins:

I’m not mad at religious people, just ignorance. You’re the one who’s being childish here, because you haven’t even considered other people’s opinions or feelings. I hope someday you’ll find happiness in your life, because you sound like such a miserable person.

carbon_boy said on February 1, 2005 08:04:

Away for 3 days and look at this!!! LOL!

I was called childish, Judith cold-hearted, and gay ppl are immature, because a certain person here on TDR won’t actually listen to what the GAY people are trying to explain to him.

Pumpkins, I guess it comes down to the fact that you DON’T want to educate yourself about what homosexuality actually is and therefore what is the point of this discussion then anyways between you and us? That my friend is what makes me angry. I’ve heard more hurtful things in the last couple of years than you have heard in your life-time. I guess for a heterosexual who thinks he knows all, it’s quite a challenge to sit down and listen to someone and then think about what they have said.

Let me tell you this: I have tons of hetero friends, and not ONE of them look at me as a lesser person. The fact being that every single one of them have accepted me for who I am, have asked me about my sexuality and actually listened.

Maybe you should do the same. They never once argued with me. Never questioned what I had to say. The reason being? Because I am gay and they are not. Do you question your doctor when he says you are ill?

Lastly I just want to go back to the comment that you made about gay people that are so angry: we are not angry, we are FRUSTRATED, because we, unlike you, have to deal with people like you every day of our lives!

Cheers

PS: Miss Medusa, hopefully the hubby will be taking me down to CT for Easter :oD Hope to get and email from you soon. Soet wees.xx

purplemedusa said on February 3, 2005 05:25:

’Ro I’ll mail you soon, angel!!

LS... CT=Cape Town