Aaso said on March 7, 2003 18:31:

I agree with you!!

StillFar said on March 7, 2003 18:32:

bin Laden?...guess you missed out on an already existing war, not your fault, who can really keep count on all the wars you’re about to fight right now...

StillFar said on March 7, 2003 19:11:

wasn’t responding to your comment, besides...I’m all calm

Santi said on March 7, 2003 19:27:

No... never...

“How many times must the cannon balls fly before they’re forever banned?
The answer, my friend, is blowin’ in the wind, the answer is blowin’ in the wind...”

Aaso said on March 7, 2003 19:58:

thx Zee... I think she can only understand when she live under such a sky that she can only see bombs instead of stars...!!

zeeshan said on March 7, 2003 21:41:

Aaso: LOLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)

vaxjoe said on March 7, 2003 21:51:

Ferdan read the 2nd reply of aaso :o)

lost-little-girl said on March 7, 2003 23:33:

@ Ferdan, for your information I applied to join the American army but I was refused entry and failed the medical because of a heart defect. So yes if the USA requests my help I am only to happy to go to the front and shoot the bastards!

ally77 said on March 8, 2003 00:11:

NO TO WAR. IT IS STUPID TO START A WAR. NEVER IN A MILLION YEAR SHOULD A WAR BEGIN. TOO MANY PEOPLE WILL LOSE THERE LIFES - INNOCENT PEOPLE................

vaxjoe said on March 8, 2003 00:23:

Ferdan:happy maybe? she thinks the war is bout bin laden LOL

vaxjoe said on March 8, 2003 00:55:

Its not a fair world we live in Nick is it?

vaxjoe said on March 8, 2003 01:06:

Thats was good Nick! (by the way we have the same name)

As the song says “If u wanna make the world a better place take a look at yourself then make a change”

As for whose fault it is ...Its our fault everybody...cause while ppl die from starvation others get rich...when ppl dont have food to eat WE are spending our time engjoying and buying things (as if material things ever made anyone happy)

Its a deeper problem mate... “But it all remained the same cos things can never change”

Its a vicious circle im afraid :o(

vaxjoe said on March 8, 2003 01:18:

No im not sleepless...im at work and very sad as well...my best friend is leaving tomorrow...i spent most of the day crying and smoking so i feel sick now ...i really need to talk to people or i’ll go crazy

vaxjoe said on March 8, 2003 01:33:

ok

zeeshan said on March 8, 2003 10:03:

DISARM IRAQ? Guess whaT? I live in Pakistan. A nuclear powered country and I am not proud of that in anyway! India is also a Nuclear Powered coutnry which means these two traditional rivals can go on WAR any time (thanks to India!). You know wat? I would like to see my government and Indian government DISARMING for good! I repeat DISARMING FOR GOOD! BUT having said that let me also take this opportunity to tell you that NO, I WILL NOT ASK MY GOVERNMENT TO DISARM NUKES WHEN ANOTHER COUNTRY WHICH HAS THE HEIGHEST NUMBER OF NUKES in the world and PROTECTS a country which has the SECOND HEIGHEST number of nukes.

Who the hell gave any right to the U.S to “disarm” other countries when it has not disarmed itself? It is more like if I smoke then I would not be able to teach my children NOT SMOKE! because they will say HEY.. DAD! YOU SMOKE!! WHY NOT US!?

Bush is only trying to be God and that is not a wise move at all. I hate to say this but many innocent American lives are on constant dangour because of this man. Er.. I also forgot to mention Bush’s dog i.e. BLAIR he is also a very dangerous person!

After Iraq comes Iran then comes Korea then china!? then what!? the World? the whole Euorope?

WAR SUCKS! WAR SUCKS! WAR SUCKS!
Peace!

camillarox said on March 8, 2003 12:01:

I think somebody here has something loose in her brain? ;)

coyboyusa said on March 8, 2003 13:37:

first of all this isn’t going to be a WAR..not in the way peopel traditionally view a war. sevondly I think theres gonna be a significant postponement..after seeing bush on tv here in america he’s ver solemn and the rift in the un is very very disenheartening. The actions in Iraq will not rid the world of bin laden so whever has that idea in their head get over it. I hope my country does only what they intend to do,... remove saddam, replace him with a government of the people then mind our own business..enough with nation building we’re not really wanted there to begin with

ally77 said on March 8, 2003 17:34:

NO TO WAR... ONCE AGAIN NO TO WAR!!!!!!

wendy said on March 8, 2003 19:50:

I can’t believe that people,in these times,still wants war....

The world is full of technology,we wanna be smart,we find ourselfs so beautiful,we’re proud of ourself,for every problem(exept AIDS :( ) they have something,....

Well,i don’t think war makes us beautiful,i don’t think we should be proud of ourself,and,if they know for everything something,why can’t they solve stupid little problems like this (cuz,actually,it is) with words,like every grown up human being....

I’m ashamed...we build houses,we give birth to babies,we make things for everyone to see,we work on our future,....
For what??? To tear it down,in less then a moment,for some stupid war???? Do we want our kids to live in a world like this????

It makes me sad :(

LittleSpooky said on March 8, 2003 23:25:

Oooh.. this is dangerous. But I’m not exactly known for living the “safe life”.

I have 2 sides to this. And yes, I’m entitled to have coflicting emotions on this, everyone is.

On one hand, I say enough is enough. I’m tired of hearing about the US supplying aid (of any kind) to other countries, when our own people are starving and homeless in the streets. I’m tired of people who make millions upon millions of dollars treating those of us who bust our asses everyday just to BARELY make it, like dirt. I have a good paying job. In fact, it’s damn good when you consider that I don’t have a degree in anything and that most people who DO have degrees, MAKE LESS THAN I DO. There’s more on that, but I don’t have all the band width in the world to post it.

On the other hand, it’s time to get Saddam Hussein OUT. He’s executed his OWN children for opposing him (or have we forgotten the son and daughter who are now dead?) He used neural gas on his OWN PEOPLE because they were a different ethnic background than him, and they dared to oppose him as well (We seem to have forgotten the Kurds from before Desert Storm circa 1991). Anyone who DARES to speak out against him winds up dead.

While the US ain’t the greatest of countries, I can at least tell my neighbour that I think he’s an anal retentive, brown nosing, idiotic fool, and not have to worry about political assassination. As it stands now, I have 20+ co-workers who have been called up by their National Guard / Reserve units:
Bret Haun and Glen Burr are 2 of my closest friends. I work closer to them than I do any of the others that are gone and their input in my life is sorely missed already.

Do I want war? No. Do I want Hussien to continue on unchecked? No. He’s had 12 YEARS to comply with the UN and disarm his weapons, and he hasn’t done it. Time should have been up YEARS ago. But he’s been left alone and now, it’s time to stop playing and get this sorted out. I support my friends and the other soldiers. Their enlistment was something that they chose to do, and I support that decision.
As for me, I can’t get into the military for several resons, but the biggest ones are: Too old (28) and I’m too fat. *shrugs* Other than that, I’m prime candidate for driving troop transports or underwater demolitions, just because of my background.

Let’s keep the peace here. I know that it’s not easy for ANYONE ANYWHERE. But let’s try to have one place where we can go and just leave it all behind. Yes?

vivien said on March 9, 2003 10:45:

I hope there is a better solution to get rid off Saddam.

Aaso said on March 9, 2003 14:07:

oh great Santi.......... you are realy a cute one!!! a great mind....

LittleSpooky said on March 9, 2003 18:31:

To split the Thread here in about 3 ways, I think one of the reasons no one is doing much about Israel and Palestine is because:

According to the Bible, once the fighting stops, and Solomon’s Temple is rebuilt (along with another religious building), it will signal the Second Coming of Christ.

I don’t put much stock in that, but this is what I’ve heard.

Santi: No kiddin. Just like we put Manuel Noreiga in power, and several others. No one said that our governmental leaders were INTELLIGENT when they picked these people *lol*

PS - Santi: It’s IRAQIS... although that’s a new word I think should be added ;o)

suburber said on March 9, 2003 23:23:

harriej, I agree with you: It´s good that Germany and France have an own opinion! That´s why we keep on demonstrating against a war!

I´ve got one thing to add: We are democrats, true? Bush is a democrat, Balkenende is one, Schröder, Chirac, Blair... Turkey has a democracy! Their parliament decided that American soldiers should NOT come to their country. But what are they doing at the moment... And what would America do without legalicy of the UN? They would start a war nevertheless.

No, my dear friends! I am very very happy that our two nations are close friends. We won´t forget what you did for Germany some 55 years ago. So, we are definately not just against America, no way! But we keep on opposition a POLITICS (!) that wants to bring democracy to others but doesn´t accept democratic decisions which are not in its own will!

Roxrider_USA said on March 10, 2003 01:21:

Hey!

I don’t want to cause any nasty discussion. However, i want to say that one of the main reasons behind Russia’s, France’s and China’s opposition is not only politics but also economics. France and Russia are Iraq’s biggest trading partners. France has many oil contracts in Iraq and Russia has many oil field development project contracts in Iraq to be started as soon as the UN suctions are lifted. France , Russia and China have altogether more than $390 billion in oil contracts and assets in Iraq. So, yeah, although politics is one of the reasons, economic interests is also a big part influencing this never seen before strong opposition. :-)

@harriej: The North Korean threat is very real and scary. North Korean has been firing short range missiles into the Sea of Japan as a kind of missile test and they also have intercepted a US unmaned spy plane over the Sea of Japan with fighter jets. Also, they have flown in South Korean air space without permission on the eve of the inauguration of South Korea’s new president. The US has already sent 24 long range bomber planes (12 B-1 bombers and 12 B-52 bombers) to the island of Guam in the Pacific Ocean a week ago. The reason they were sent to Guam is to aware North Korea that they shouldn’t try anything crazy and because the 24 bombers can easily reach North Korea from there.

Peace out friends.
Carlos E., New York.

zeeshan said on March 10, 2003 06:15:

Let me ask you once again. Why in the world U.S.A “orders” other countries to disarm while it has Nukes too? WHY?

Is BUSH not dangerous? I ask you all IS BUSH NOT DANGEROUS? You talk about Saddam, you talk about Iran and you talk about N. Korea. I say BUSH is a threat to the whole world. Never I have felt that IRAQ is a threat for my country. I bet u must not feel that way too. It is just stupid propaganda. Look, I am not concerned if he killed his own children or not or if he poisoned his own people or not. NONE OF MY PROBLEM. I am not bothered to go and help them untill or unless Iraqis and I mean common Iraqi people call for the help.

If Iraq is being asked to DISARAM then so should U.S.A, Israel, Pakistan, Russia, India and other “declared” nuklear powers in the world. Again tell me.. is BUSH not dangerous? How many of you feel insecure beause of BUSH? how many of you feel that U.S.A. is trying to “control” your country? How many of you think that SADDAM is trying to control your country? No people... no my dear friends, my fellow Roxers. The question that all of us should be asking to our self is IF SADDAM IS A THREAT AND SO IS BUSH THEN SHOUD BOTH NOT BE REPLACED??

Americans WAKE UP! your lives are in threat. There is a “clear and present danger”. Wake up people. Start protesting. Start making some noise. TELL YOUR MEDIA TO SHUT UP and “ORDER” your government to sit quiet before it gets too late for all of us.

Peace and love,
Zee

kachina008 said on March 10, 2003 22:17:

Thanks for answering my qns lilspooky ;)

lonely_girl said on March 11, 2003 09:05:

Oh my, I know that it is dangerous to answer such a sensitive question but I will:

I’m against war.

Things that give me to think in this connection:
1) The US-government and the English governement couldn’t prove that Iraq is still having weapons of mass desructions and the “proves” they used were mainly faked.

2) The connections to bin Laden with Iraq couldn’t be proved either

3) The governments mainly in Europe who have other opiniouns than USA of England are treadened like stupid children that are unwilling to obey. I thought that expressing our free will is a human right?

4) a war against Iraq would make the people there more upset towards the western world which causes more terror and more support to Al Kaida so we (the western world) would have to live with the fear that terror attacs like 9/11 could be repeated.

5) why is the US governement not more concerned about North Corea? This state owns nuclear weapons and they are testing rockets...

Don’t get me wrong, I think that Saddam Hussein has to be removed because he’s a terrorist and the Iraqi people suffer. But The proves to start a war aren’t strong enough for me.

lost-little-girl said on March 11, 2003 18:43:

Ferdan, I think we should put you out on front line!!

coyboyusa said on March 11, 2003 18:57:

on the issue of the iraquis overthrowing sadaam...i wonder this

is the inherent muslim mistrust of the western world what stops them from overthrowing him themselves...they both don’t view america with much respect....i mean the sactions are a UN action yet everywhere u turn the media calls them american sanctions....

oh and another thing...i honestly don’t feel too threatened by nuclear proliferation I know it sounds insane...my bigger question is where is all the nuclear waste going to go...russia can’t keep up with thiers they have nuclear subs sitting in the ocean rotting away ..what are all these muslim countries gonna do...turn the deserts into toxic waste dumps?

Santi said on March 11, 2003 20:55:

I think it’s serious that USA threats France in case they block the UN resolution. I think it’s very serious.

Santi said on March 11, 2003 20:57:

According to “European Intelligence” one of the guys that crashed the Boeing against World Trade Centre took lessons in flying in an airport that is 15 kilometres away from where I live... Maybe they should bomb Valencia too.

Roxrider_USA said on March 12, 2003 04:37:

Washington (CNN): A C-131 “Samaritan” aircraft dropped the bomb on a test range at the western reaches of the base shortly after 2 p.m. ET. A Pentagon official who reviewed videotape of the blast said the bomb created a tall cloud of debris that billowed into the sky but did not resemble the mushroom-shaped cloud of a nuclear blast. The Air Force videotape was to be released later.

MOAB is much bigger than any other conventional bomb in the U.S. arsenal. Dropped out of the rear of a transport plane and guided by global positioning satellites, it spreads a flammable mist over the target, then ignites it, producing a highly destructive blast.

That’s a piece of the report on the MOAB test.

Take care!
Carlos E., New York.

LittleSpooky said on March 12, 2003 06:48:

Kachina: S’alright :o)

Holy sh*t. The Moab Bomb. Wanna know where it got its name?! MOAB, UTAH. That’s right. The bomb was named after a town/county/region (whatever) of UTAH. Of all places. Of course, someone tried to get it named the Hurricane (pronounced Hur-eh-cun. Utahns... morons as they are) Bomb (I think that’s taken). The Juab (Joo-ab) Bomb... anything BUT Moab since Moab’s a prime tourist spot (ARCHES Natn’l Park etc)

Just a little news flash.

Utah... famous for Mormons, Mini-Vans, Methlabs, and now Bombs *lmfao*

Jud (moderator) said on March 12, 2003 08:14:

“Also, support for a war without UN authorization has increased from 48% to 55% here in the US. People are saying that they are getting impatient with the UN inaffectiveness. People believe that the UN diplomacy is not going anywhere and that this diplomacy may take another 12 years.”

Oh cmon this is half of the people, so i wouldn’t say people are changing their mind dramatically... if it would be 70% or sth.. :P

LOL about the French flags and all. They will have a lot of trouble in Spain if they have to follow Bush orders to not be friends with France anymore. A LOT of our economy consists in exporting/ importing to/from France!

LOL What do the others have to do then? Put France flags in the balcony and get france flags pins on our coats? :D:D

But of course, our beloved president just cares about what his pocket will get for supporting the war, he is out of the goverment in 1 year about - cuz he won’t be candidate for president anymore...I wonder why the hell he is not leaving us alone then ...

15th March - they are talking about a second demonstration, I read something about that in Spanish newspapers, is that true?

kachina008 said on March 12, 2003 10:44:

freedom fries and freedom toast?????
oh *PLEASE* :P

nelina said on March 12, 2003 14:03:

I am against every war that can make more children die! And in Iraq, 10 years after the first golf war children continue to die because of malnurishment and the effects of the bombs the americans dropped.
Lost little girl, I am sure that the images of the iraqi hospitals never come to your country. But in Greece, we watch them on television, and trust me these people are suffering already enough!

Aaso said on March 12, 2003 14:19:

oh no... please stop WAR........ I can not stand anything more about it.... !!!!!!!!!!!!!
:(((

Roxrider_USA said on March 12, 2003 15:03:

@Nelina: Unfortunately.

Take care!
Carlos E., New York.

Roxrider_USA said on March 12, 2003 15:41:

I know! Lol.... They are thinking about that only to not have say or use the word French.

Carlos E., New York.

Roxrider_USA said on March 12, 2003 16:22:

Uhmm.. it can go both ways. For example, those who suppor the US such as the UK, Spain and Bulgaria believe so probably because they’ll get many fat benefices by standing with the US whereas the ones who oppose the US such as China, Russia and France and many Arab states have political reasons such as their governmental offices and oil and trade contracts with Iraq.

As our friend Santi says it’s all about politics or better yet “geopolitics”. After all, what government want to put in risk their political careers and fat economic benefices if their won’t be any compensations afterwards? It’s as simple as that. Just like in business, interests come first. It’s doesn’t matter if you preserve your interests by playing the evil starting a war or playing the nice one by trying to prevent a war. It’s all about interests when it comes to governments and companies.

Peace out, guys!
Carlos E., New York.

StillFar said on March 12, 2003 17:01:

Roxrider, got your point, but I do have to disagree. The question whether to start a war or to prevent a war is not a question where you just decide yes or no. A war, in whatever form and against whoever, has to be justified. You need reasons to attack a country. Until know Bush/Blair just talk a lot of crap, repeat it every no and then and think that they can make a case without an argument. Well, this is the question that has to be answered before it’s coming to interest. Is there a reason to attack Iraq after a very calm 12 years? Why now? I think if the States would make a case, most countries would agree, but some sentiment about recent events can’t make that case...maybe it can in the states, but there’s not much support elsewhere...except from countries that have been threatened or promised support

Roxrider_USA said on March 12, 2003 17:13:

@Stillfar: The world is not fair. :-(( We know that the powerfull leads and rules. That plus geopolitics and the terrorist threats of such high magnitudes that never before threatened the US have contributed to the now time frame. As unfortunate and said as it is, that’s how the world works. Past history has many of examples of this. A classic one is the Cold War. It clearly shows how two superpowers fiercely defend their interests and geopolitics. From that we got, the Korean war, the Vietnam war, the criation of NATO and the Iron Curtain and many other conflicts. All ’cause the two most powerful countries in the world at the time wanted to protect their interests.

I just wish it all worked differently. :-((!

Love.
Carlos E., New York.

Roxrider_USA said on March 12, 2003 18:16:

@Stillfar: That’s the new mentality in the US government and of many people here too especially because many people are deeply affected by those attacks and others are angry at it. That’s how they view the US position after 09/11. That’s why Bush keeps always saying that after 09/11 everything changed. So, i’m passing to you guys what the way of thinking here is.

Yep, i know that such policy may bring more attacks and this is sad. Wish it was different. Anyway, we shouldn’t have a war.

Take care friend!
Carlos E., New York.

Santi said on March 12, 2003 20:17:

I agree on many things with StillFar :)

StillFar said on March 13, 2003 15:23:

Roxrider, I start to like you! Respect, your eyes aren’t closed!

zeeshan said on March 13, 2003 19:11:

Judith: I see you rememeber that. When I told my friends what you told me i.e. the french-to-freedom name change all of ’em were laughing their lungs out. Then ofcourse came my question about the french kiss!? and u can imagine what kinda affect it made on the already crazy situation!

Aaso: I am concerned about IRAN. After Iraq comes Iran and Iran means MY REGION and people of my religion!!!!!!!! I can’t stand it anymore. GOOD LUCK Aaso.. take good care.. My prayers are with you and Iraqis.

To everybody else... PLEASE DO SOMETHING TO STOP THE WAR. The best thing you could do is SPREAD THE WORD OUT. Which word? the word of wisdom the word of peace and USA’s hidden aims behind the war.

Zee

coyboyusa said on March 13, 2003 19:23:

like your country is any better stop being a hypocrite man

zeeshan said on March 13, 2003 21:22:

need I to say anything?? Thanks Judith!

I also see some people NOT reading previous posts before trying to FLAME others :) I LOVE TDR.. every time something like this thread turns up and I get to learn the ever changing attitudes of human beings and their mental conditions ofcourse.

Santi said on March 13, 2003 22:08:

@Roxrider: I learnt that my teacher of Edafology doesn’t know what is an enzyme!!! :D lol!!!

sweet_stalker57 said on March 14, 2003 00:19:

http://www.sniksnak.com/jokester/osama/newtexas.jpg

zeeshan said on March 14, 2003 15:30:

coyboyusa: you amuse me just the way your comments amuse soo many of the TDR members. Do you even know what kind of opinion most of the people have for you? I bet u don’t even care. ANywayz, keep on posting your “amusing” posts up here. I like to have a laff ever now and then.

Cheers!
Zee

zeeshan said on March 14, 2003 15:31:

sweet: hehehehe gr8 !! hehehe

Roxrider_USA said on March 14, 2003 20:11:

Hey, you can start whatever thread you want to. Besides, who doesn’t want to talk about a possible just won’t post in this one. Relax friend!!!

Take care!
Carlos E., New York.

Santi said on March 14, 2003 20:18:

Oh, sorry... in English is “Soil Science” :D

sweet_stalker57 said on March 15, 2003 04:27:

I would bet my life you don’t have a passport and your dream vacation is probably Las Vegas.

Aaso said on March 15, 2003 13:30:

Yes ... we are coming to an end.. March 17th is already here... people you are just talking and talking and teasing each other.... what have you done? what do you think about future..!!!! All Iraqi prople... haa... they are the only ones who will be flamed...

2 Zee yes after it.. it’s our turn... oh GOD

We need only peace here!!!!!!!!!! nothing more

love you friends

Santi said on March 15, 2003 21:56:

@Zee: Don’t forget that Sweden is the most americanized country in Europe, and that if it wasn’t because of France (that is Europe too) the attack would be a reality by now.
And you shouldn’t forget that GOVERNMENTS are making the war, NOT PEOPLE. Today there have been many demonstrations all around the world (Europe INCLUDED!). You shouldn’t forget that (for example) Spaniards do NOT want war, though the asshole of Aznar is making so many efforts to put us in... Remember people is not the government!

coyboyusa said on March 16, 2003 01:54:

peopl need to wake up and get ur terminology right this isn’t a war :)

Roxrider_USA said on March 16, 2003 02:30:

Hi! That’s right Santi. People should not flame or yell at other people ’cause the ones responsible for the actions of our countries are our governments. It’s alright to support or not support our governments ’cause it’s perfectly okay do what you believe is right . However, many times what some people believe is right, is actually wrong, unfortunately. Be open-minded! See what’s behind the curtain!!! Then do the right thing!!! :-)

P.S. : Unfortunately this up coming week seems to be the last week before the first shot is fired. :-(!

Peace out friends!
Carlos E., New York.

vaxjoe said on March 16, 2003 02:53:

Roxrider: Cant u be more neutral? add some colour in it!

vaxjoe said on March 16, 2003 03:41:

the “more neutral” was ironic...i meant U SOUND too neutral in general!

First of all read all what i wrote NOT only the part that its convenient for u to comment...

Their brother and i thought it would be wiser for them to have a honeymoon in Europe (since they ve never travelled abroad) with less money than spend a fortune to go from michigan to maine!

U can disagree however u want...my comment on you was about that “they can do whatever they want” ...Sure they can ...but still its hilarious to me..

And Carlos...u re not that “politically correct” in real life are u? I hope its only ur profile of your TDR persona...

sweet_stalker57 said on March 16, 2003 04:36:

I just had a great idea! All the TDR members can pitch in and send you to Kampuchea!!! Take a lovely stroll through Battambang, Banteay Meanchey, Pursat, Siem Reap and Kampong Thom provinces, into the forests or dry paddy fields!!! :)

Santi said on March 16, 2003 10:57:

@Carlos: Ehm... You should believe more in democracy. And “our politicians” should too. Cuz we pay their wages, and we elected them to represent US.
When Aznar stands beside Bush saying that UN should accept the stupid resolution, and most people on the streets are going to demonstrations against it, when they talk about peace but first they want to attack Bagdag (where, if they do, a lot of innocent people is gonna die and they know it) while we are talking about peace being peaceful and solve this conflict in a peaceful way... Mr Aznar is NOT representing me... and the 75% Spaniards or more who are against the war. And he is supposed to represent me all the time he’s president :O

They are not untouchable, more inteligent (especially Bush...), than we are... (they are not saints...) they should be one of us that takes the decissions that are good for us & ACCORDING TO OUR WILL. Well, so Aznar wants to attack Iraq... is that OK? :O No, it’s not, cuz “everything for people but without people” is something that stopped existing (or officially started disappearing) in 1789 , cuz democracy means listening to the will of us.

If they actually have any proof they should SHOW IT. For us to decide with all the information available. Cuz lack of information leads to wrong decission many times... they’ve been asked for the proofs and I haven’t seen any... so I believe it’s just an excuse to bomb Iraq, cuz Bush is obsessed with Sadam (cuz the previous Bush couldn’t beat him... I guess).

So: NOT IN MY NAME...

zeeshan said on March 16, 2003 13:15:

Yet another reason for all of us to keep on loving Per Gessle! :)

Zee

coyboyusa said on March 16, 2003 18:48:

btw sweet talker i don’t hate muslims just the ones that strap dynomite to their 5 yr old kids or attack peopel cause they rtoo lazy to do anything for themselves so they think murdering peopel to get it is the right way

Roxrider_USA said on March 16, 2003 21:57:

@Vaxjoe: I don’t see why i’d be politically incorrect. I’ve been living in the US for almost 6 years, so that’s why my info on TDR says USA as the country even though i’m brazilian. It only makes sense to put down the place you live. Why would i say i live in Brazil if i haven’t lived there for the last 5 years and 7 months?

But, hey, thanks for commenting on what i had asked. :-)!

@Santi: I get what you mean. Democracy is the will and/or voice of the majority of the people of a certain state. So, yeah, leaders should hear the majority of the people in countries like the UK and Spain. However, here in the US, the majority supports president Bush. I don’t want a war although i think Saddam is ruthless. Unfotunately, i’m part of the minority right now here in the US.

Be safe, friends.
Carlos E., New York.

suburber said on March 16, 2003 22:47:

Well, whatever irony means to u...

Cowards in the UN?

German oil profits in Iraq?

Aaso said on March 17, 2003 14:41:

God help us...(*^*) :(((((

StillFar said on March 17, 2003 16:29:

scary...now the UN is disrespected...what comes next?

Roxrider_USA said on March 17, 2003 17:45:

@Mel: These numbers are from MSNBC and CNN news channels. The numbers were given out today (03/17/03) by these two news agencies. However, i don’t recall the error margin for these numbers, though. I’m trying to find other polls that may confirm these numbers. :-).

Take care Mel. Kisses!! :-)

Carlos E., New York.

Roxrider_USA said on March 17, 2003 18:57:

That’s why Spanish and UK prime ministers are under fire there and having their political careers damaged whereas people here believe that President Bush hadling of the crises is appropriate.

Personally, something that i believe causes this totally different views is the 9/11 attacks. The attacks happened here and the people here actually felt its horribles effects whereas in Europe and other countries around the world, although people think it’s horrible, they didn’t live through it nor their countries received such terrible attacks. For me, that’s the key reason for such completely different views. That’s how i feel.

Take care.
Carlos E., New York.

Jud (moderator) said on March 17, 2003 19:09:

what does Iraq have to do with the 11/sept? The “reason” for attacking is that they are supposed to have all those weapons that many other countries included US have, so I really dont see the link.

In Spain we have been hit many times with “internal” terrorists, so its NOT that we don’t know what terrorists attacks are. We are just reacting different, I would say, maybe because we didn’t have one attack but many, and in different areas of the country, and some attacks have been quite close to eachother, and we have lived a civil war not long ago, and there’s still people alive (my grandmum and my parents for example) who suffered from and lived it. And we have suffered a dictatorship. So I would say Spaniards *know* how it feels like. We just react different.

Roxrider_USA said on March 17, 2003 19:22:

@Judith and Stillfar: Guys, have i said that it justifies an attack? Nope. Pay attention to what i said. The people in the US think like that. They feel like that. I’m not saying that it justifies attacks. Come on guys, please read carefully what people say. :-)

Yep, people react differently. That’s right. But can we really discuss reactions and blame these reactions when they are linked to emotions and beliefs created by horrific events ? That’s the problem! That’s why reactions here and there are so different.

Take care!
Carlso E., New York.

zeeshan said on March 17, 2003 19:31:

someone needs to sleep a lot these days cuz this someone seems to be watching a lot of CNN and thus has no knowledge of things what-so-ever. Ths most intelligent american would understand who I am talking about :D

StillFar said on March 17, 2003 19:38:

Roxrider: yes I think I can discuss reactions. What happenend on 9/11 was shocking...for everyone. I think most people tolerated when the war against Osama Bin Laden started. However, there’s a point where every person has to come to its senses again. Whatever happened 9/11 isn’t in connection to Iraq, it’s only a pathetic propaganda system and a moron of a president that somehow gets the people to follow him, as he uses anger to unite people, which is the worst thing a leader can do. It’s not the way you feel, it’s the way you are supposed to feel!

vaxjoe said on March 17, 2003 20:18:

Look at your young men fighting
Look at your women crying
Look at your young men dying
The way they’ve always done before

Look at the hate we’re breeding
Look at the fear we’re feeding
Look at the lives we’re leading
The way we’ve always done before

My hands are tied
The billions shift from side to side
And the wars go on with brainwashed pride
For the love of God and our human rights
And all these things are swept aside
By bloody hands time can’t deny
And are washed away by your genocide
And history hides the lies of our civil wars
——————————————————-

And
I don’t need your civil war
It feeds the rich while it buries the poor
Your power hungry sellin’ soldiers
In a human grocery store
Ain’t that fresh
I don’t need your civil war

Look at the shoes your filling
Look at the blood we’re spilling
Look at the world we’re killing
The way we’ve always done before
Look in the doubt we’ve wallowed
Look at the leaders we’ve followed
Look at the lies we’ve swallowed
And I don’t want to hear no more

zeeshan said on March 17, 2003 20:23:

@stillfar: thanks for being honest and bold here.

@vax: :)

Santi said on March 17, 2003 20:31:

(I didn’t mean religious beliefs but *religious law*... in Spanish is called Talion’s Law)

zeeshan said on March 17, 2003 20:48:

@Roxrider: Thanks for being understanding. Again, I am not insulting or hurting anyone. Never have, never will. I am just trying to express myself to the internation community here in TDR that is all. Your comments are a clear denial to my earlier question. I hope as long as guys like you are in America, we will always have a hope. Thanks again.

Z

zeeshan said on March 17, 2003 20:58:

Santi, to be honest I can’t understand your core point and secondly, atleast I don’t need to flame people (specially the ones I like like YOU!!)

Z

Roxrider_USA said on March 17, 2003 21:55:

@Santi: In Brazil it’s said “olho por olho, dente por dente”. (Something like: An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth). It’s interesting. I think Santi understands what i mean by the effects of 9/11 on the american people.

Carlos E., New York.

Roxrider_USA said on March 18, 2003 00:14:

@Zeeshan: Well, personally for me i think that he doesn’t have anything to do with 9/11. But 55% of americans believe so. What i meant when i said that Santi may understand what i mean, concerns to the religious issue that Santi talks about in a few posts above.

I hope no or very few innocent people don’t lose their lives and that a better Iraq comes out of this war. Praying. Now i’ll go watch President Bush’s national address. Take care friends!

Carlos E., New York.

Jud (moderator) said on March 18, 2003 12:47:

no.. most of spaniards don’t support the war... but our great president does not hear the people, nice eh?

Santi said on March 18, 2003 13:22:

The fact is that... Hussein family has been said to leave the country cuz USA is gonna attack Bagdag... so... if they are gonna attack & they wanna kill Saddam and they tell him to leave... then it’s clear they don’t give a shit for the Iraqis that are the ones that are gonna die in fact... I mean... euh...

vaxjoe said on March 18, 2003 14:40:

Look at the shoes your filling
Look at the blood we’re spilling
Look at the world we’re killing
The way we’ve always done before
Look in the doubt we’ve wallowed
Look at the leaders we’ve followed
Look at the lies we’ve swallowed
And I don’t want to hear no more

Roxrider_USA said on March 18, 2003 17:34:

Hi!

Latest news here:

–>As Vaxjoe said above Australia, Poland and Japan support the war.

–>French diplomat says that if Saddam uses chemical and/or biological weapons on US and UK soldiers, then France may join in the conflict.

–>Australia is going to send 2.000 troops to the conflict region.

–>Spain said it won’t send millitary troops to Iraq but will provide chemical/biological desinfection personnel and other specific personnel.

Latest poll:

–>After President Bush’s speech last night:
Now 71% of americans support President Bush concerning an Iraq invasion. (Statistics from an ABC news agency poll).

That’s all.
Take care.
Carlos E., New York.

Aaso said on March 18, 2003 18:14:

2 Carl thx... I try watch CNN and BBC and FOX more carefully ;)

Aaso said on March 18, 2003 19:22:

Zee that was nice ... but I can not see some facts on my TV .. so I have to watch those staffs!!!

coyboyusa said on March 18, 2003 19:30:

oh and along the lines of bush being a moron and a war monger...if i rember right winston churchill was view the same way when he vehemently warned europe and britan of the impending peril that hitler posed to the world and he was ridiculed for it...and look what happened

StillFar said on March 18, 2003 20:07:

Coyboy, I don’t know if you travel a lot. Well if you do, you will find out that some people have different visions of the world we live in. Saying there will be freedom and democracy isn’t an easy task considering extremist groups sharing the same land & hating each other. You think a leading power, that’s more hated than what they already have is making a change?
I won’t be able to change your mind about if a war against Iraq is necessary at this moment or not. But here are some things you might want to think about. Almost two years ago, the world deeply sympathized with the United States. Look at the world today! Have you ever experienced a colder front against your country throughout your lifetime? Rumsfeld declared France and Germany as old Europe, an insult, just because he didn’t agree with their opinion to avoid war. To excuse himself, he compares Germany with Cuba…I think you know about the American history with Cuba, so no need to explain more. Bush declares Iran, North Korea and Iraq as Axes of Evil, an expression that was used during the 2 World War. Using that expression, you might have to consider that these countries won’t sit back to get attacked. The situation with North Korea is adding another threat to an already vulnerable world peace. Going to the UN and finally giving a shit about the worlds opinion (if it’s not shared by your own) isn’t helping either. It just unites already angered (ex)-Allies, awakes sleeping enemies and makes them sympathize with the real enemy.
A war and killing innocent people needs justification. What your government is presenting is no justification, they simply bring allegations and don’t give the people, who are trying to find evidence, the time to do so.
Coyboy, I’m sorry, but I really do believe Bush is a moron, I have never seen a leader of a country failing so badly as he did during only three years of presidency.

Roxrider_USA said on March 18, 2003 20:19:

@Stillfar: Thanks concerning the “might”.

@others: Remember, the majority of the people in Iraq don’t have access to open newscasts through TV or radio ’cause it’s all blocked. Also, people fear Saddam. (I have never seen in an election all voters in the country vote for the same leader and no one vote against or undecided even though there were no other candidates). I mean, Saddam got 100% of all votes. Do you think that this would have happened under normal democratic voting conditions ? Only the fact that the people had the choice of only one candidate is strange. What do you guys think? :-)

Later!
Carlos E., New York.

zeeshan said on March 18, 2003 20:24:

“But here are some things you might want to think about. Almost two years ago, the world deeply sympathized with the United States. Look at the world today! Have you ever experienced a colder front against your country throughout your lifetime? Rumsfeld declared France and Germany as old Europe, an insult, just because he didn’t agree with their opinion to avoid war. To excuse himself, he compares Germany with Cuba…I think you know about the American history with Cuba, so no need to explain more. Bush declares Iran, North Korea and Iraq as Axes of Evil, an expression that was used during the 2 World War. Using that expression, you might have to consider that these countries won’t sit back to get attacked. The situation with North Korea is adding another threat to an already vulnerable world peace. Going to the UN and finally giving a shit about the worlds opinion (if it’s not shared by your own) isn’t helping either. It just unites already angered (ex)-Allies, awakes sleeping enemies and makes them sympathize with the real enemy.
A war and killing innocent people needs justification. What your government is presenting is no justification, they simply bring allegations and don’t give the people, who are trying to find evidence, the time to do so.
Coyboy, I’m sorry, but I really do believe Bush is a moron, I have never seen a leader of a country failing so badly as he did during only three years of presidency. “

StillFar: that was gr8. I agree!!!!!!!!

Yes the U.S. is facing a hard time but the people nor the government realize this dangerous situation. An attack on IRAQ means U.S taking over the 12% of the earth’s oil reserves thus making many contries feel insecure and defenitely angry!

Z

StillFar said on March 18, 2003 21:01:

I thought the thanx was ironic...

StillFar said on March 18, 2003 21:16:

“everyone views super powers in an unpopular light”
that’s exactly the reason why your country has to act wisely. Your government wants to lead, so let them lead, but lead in a way that makes the world a better place. If you act out of misery, hurt, anger or arrogance it just won’t be appreciated.
“its our inability or reluctance to share all evidence”
all evidence? Which evidence are you talking about? To my knowledge there’s none.
“i believe that there is good reason for it”
this is not going to church and believing there’s a god without proof, this is a war on people that aren’t any different from the people killed in the world trade center. You need more than belief….
“we need to start learning from history and stop repeating it”
good point, unfortunately recent history proves you wrong…

Roxrider_USA said on March 19, 2003 00:14:

@Malmo: Regretably i don’t think a dialogue can be continued with such hatred and dirt in your words. If you want to discuss your point do so in a civilized way. However, if you can’t abstain others from, at least those who a bothered by your terrible words, the pitful attitude that you showed above, learn how to discuss in a more polite and respectful way.

Have you stopped to think that not all people living in the US are americans? Stop and think.

Hoping for better discussion with in the future,
Carlos E., New York.

LittleSpooky said on March 19, 2003 02:19:

For clarification purposes (and you can go and look it up anywhere on the net)

In 1955, the United Nations changed the religious classification of the United States from Christian to Pagan. Check the UN charter.

DO NOT tell me that the US is a Christian state, I will tell you that you are full of it. It IS official. How do I know this? My mother was born in 1955 and when you look at “The Year In Review” for that year, it is listed. You have to wade through a lot of stuff, but you can find it on just about any search engine for the United Nations.

ally77 said on March 19, 2003 09:43:

I think the Bush and Blair suck......

Ferdan said on March 19, 2003 10:51:

Aaso, i have a sad new.
Part of your goverment is accused of 2 bombings in my country (One against the Israel’s embassy and the other against the AMIA, a jewish organization), responsible of the death of more than 100 people.

It was just a suspect a few years ago, but Israel’s intelligence said it was all true.

“According to a report in the New York Times, the Iranian government not only organized the bombing of a Jewish community center in Buenos Aires, but also paid Argentina’s president to cover it up.

Citing a transcript of a secret deposition in the inquiry into the 1994 bombing, the report said that Carlos Saúl Menem, a Roman Catholic of Syrian Muslim descent who was president from 1989 to 1999, had received $10 million to downplay the Iranian link. “

this is the link when it was just a theory
http://www.ict.org.il/spotlight/det.cfm?id=807

It is so sad :(

MadTom said on March 19, 2003 12:51:

@vivien

That’s a really good point!! It’s such a nonsense what is happening with the world at the moment. Bush wants to give the world the reasons for a war, but he failed. A war just because USA believes that Hussein has got weapons of mass-destruction? USA has so much other problems so solve but instead of that they throw bombs on people who can’t avoid them. Hussein is a dictactor and has to be replaced by a democratic leader but can we only realise this through another war??
I’ve read that Per once said that Joyride was such a massive hit in america because the people needs some happy music to get over the gulf war somehow. Hopefully this doesn’t happen again.
Imagine all the people living live in peace...

nelina said on March 19, 2003 13:58:

It is very likely that war begins tonight. Now, I only hope that it will end soon...

vaxjoe said on March 19, 2003 15:40:

Aaso: dont u cryyyyyy tonight i still love u babyyyyy

Go listen to “little miss sorrow” and u’ll be fine
*smooch*

vaxjoe said on March 19, 2003 16:26:

I know it’s hard to keep an open heart
When even friends seem out to harm you
But if you could heal a broken heart
Wouldn’t time be out to charm you

:o)

vaxjoe said on March 19, 2003 16:42:

Lay beside me, under wicked sky
The black of day, dark of night, we share this paralyze
The door cracks open, but there’s no sun shining through
Black hearts scarring darkness still, but there’s no sun shining through
—————————–
What I’ve felt, what I’ve known
Sick and tired, I stand alone
Could you be there, ’cause I’m the one who waits for you
Or are you unforgiven too?

*hugs*

wendy said on March 19, 2003 16:58:

pathetic bush..............

Ferdan said on March 19, 2003 17:11:

aaso
it wasn’t my intention to make you cry

may i give you a hug? :))

vivien said on March 19, 2003 17:40:

@Wendy
I agree.

And Bush shouldn´t had any chance to being president if his dad wasn´t the old Bush.
So maybe the next president will be Clinton´s daughter....

vaxjoe said on March 19, 2003 18:15:

...Clinton’s Hairdresser? lol

kachina008 said on March 19, 2003 22:06:

The bombing has already begun

powerpoplarry said on March 20, 2003 00:56:

OK, I tended to avoid this subject cuz I hate war, and the whole topic, but it’s really just unavoidable at this point, with war starting in 10 minutes. :(

Um, I wish their was another solution, I really do, but I can see Bush’s point of view. Saddam is a master of deception, and has tried to make a mockery of the whole world for the past 12 years. I wish he would step down, and make war not possible, but in reality, he started it, and he even kills his own people. It seems Bush’s objective is to go in, kill the bastard + his sons ONLY and get out, not hurt any of the Iraqi people. Bush wants to set them free of dictatorship, that’s it. It seems if he doesn’t do that, Iraq’s terrorship will continue.

It’s a catch 22 really, not go in and have the terror continue and have the US be viewed as a chicken or start a war and get it over with?? Tough choice, but Bush thinks war is. He thinks that once Saddam is defeated, terror will be shot down once again, that’s his goal. I guess he just wants to take initiative, that’s all. Hopefully, this will end soon, and they kill the bastard, as no one else will take charge.

Believe me, I’m not for this war, no way, but Saddam made it be the only choice.

AASO, I hope you’re safe, and sorry to say, Ferdan is right, your country’s government may have improved over the past 5 years, but they are not saints either, and have committed much evil. I hope they steer away from Islamic evil too, and go against Saddam’s ways completely. I have hope, and I hope you are safe. Come here and be an ally!! :-)