nate said on August 2, 2006 22:32:

Yes Andres,

I will definitely pray for this.

Blessings

Eric (Nate)

MiracleMan said on August 2, 2006 23:36:

Compassion for the situation is what they’re looking for, CB, not a slap in the face for a call to prayer.

nate said on August 3, 2006 01:16:

@ Andres,

please check your e-mail, I’ve sent you a message.

ally77 said on August 3, 2006 13:36:

Once again coyboyusa opens his massive mouth and puts into gear his unreponsive brain cells!

whateveriam said on August 3, 2006 18:33:

I just hope for an end to the conflict. Both sides are equally to blame for this, not just Hezbollah GT-85.

I would pray, but I’m not religious. I lost faith in humanity a long time ago.

rox-kuryliw said on August 3, 2006 19:13:

i dont pray, i dont believe it does nothing, sorry i think the situation is far more in depth and complicated.

I do hope with all my heart no more innocent lives get taken for other’s evil.

Oldag75 said on August 4, 2006 01:02:

“It’s curious to ask for a prayer when the whole conflict is religion-related... Maybe they should stop praying and start thinking with their brains.”

Santi is absolutely correct. Religion, un-thinking mysticism, which is fueling the whole Middle East mess, is wholly irrational – that is, it completely ignores reason and logic, mechanisms of the human brain.

These religious kooks, who have now engaged us in World War IV (WWIII was the defeat of Russian communism), are going to completely destabilize the Earth, if they get their way. Idiots, they are.

Room_service said on August 4, 2006 06:16:

You can’t blame people for being religious. The problem is if that feeling gets out of hand. Same for chocolate: you can like it. But if you eat 10 bars per day that is not very healthy.

Seems like you are confused. You think religious people is irrational. That’s not true. Remember there are things that reason and logic can’t explain. The brain is not as poweful as you believe, it’s not able to analyze every thing that happens in this world.

If I remember well, wars like Vietnam and Korea were not fuelled for any religion.

pwbbounce (moderator) said on August 4, 2006 07:14:

Read these lyrics. With all the wars, and fighting in the world at the moment, everyone should be pulling together as one.

That was my brother lost in the rubble
That was my sister lost in in the crush
That was our mothers, those were our children
That was our fathers, that was each of us
A million prayers to god above
A million tears make an ocean

One for love
One for truth
One for me, one for you

I found spirit, they couldn’t ruin it
I found courage in the smoke and dust
I found faith in the songs you silenced
Deep down its ringing out in each of us

One for love
One for truth
One for me, one for you
Where we once divided, now we stand united
We stand as one, Undivided

How many hands? How many hearts?
How many dreams been torn apart?
Enough, Enough....
The time has come to rise back up as...

One for love
One for truth
One for me, one for you
Where we once divided, now we stand united
We stand as one, Undivided

I think there’s something in there, never drop down, always be hopeful

Ferdan said on August 4, 2006 22:09:

Truck full of fruits attacked by Israel air strikes... death toll 40 civilians
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,20025642-23109,00.htm...

Santi said on August 5, 2006 07:03:

Oh well, Emil... you’re well known for misunderstanding me all the time. When did I take it on the religious people? The problem is not the people, IT IS the RELIGION. I clearly say “start thinking with their brains”, so is more than wrong that I called them brainless... you’re wicked and always looking for a minimum flaw to attack me, but I simply won’t give you the chance.
Religion demands you to believe in magical things happening all the time, like everything that happens is the will of some “human like minds” that live in a parallel reality with total powers. If that’s logical and deals with reality... well, but maybe we need to redefine the terms here.
Besides religion forces you to accept intellectually unsatisfying answers and openly begs for quiting asking difficult questions (like the beginning of the universe, how humans came to be and all that).

I don’t think you ponder the facts when you just log in the internet, that the internet itself and the technology we enjoy today is possible just because some very brave pioneer thinkers (in some cases even monks) challenged the status quo of Church in the past. If it was for the church, we’d still be well living in the middle ages. How does one come to satellite communications if the earth is flat... I wonder...

Then as user Room-Service said, “You can’t blame people for being religious”. I think that’s very true and it’s one of the scariest things about religion. Because in 95% of the cases people are taught in religions without even giving them the chance to think about it. The single most influential factor for being a “customer” or “believer” of a certain faith, is merely that your parents believed in it, not how logical, true or reasonable it is. And that’s scary. Kids obviously are not (normally) going to challenge the beliefs of the people they most trust in, and religions take advantage of that and are recorded into the minds of those poor ignorant kids who don’t have intelecual defenses against that. Well, if it wasn’t religion we would be talking about mental abuse, but you see how things are.

Btw, Emil... I’ll take it on religion every time religion comes up, like in this thread, because I think it’s a threat and I’m convinced is something from another time that we would be much better without.

Finally, on the conflict at hand: Of course is not only religion. But to the people living it (the israeli and the lebanese) is that. That’s what matters most. To the israeli leaders is geopolitics and to Hizbulah is a reason to attack them apart from geopolitics. But they like to make us think is the hatred of two religions. The whole thing depends on water sources and availability, obviously. Because no development can take place without water and it’s basic to life... and we’re talking about a deserted (in the natural -not human- sense of the word) area.
Or did you think that the shape of Israel is like that because Picasso designed it?

whateveriam said on August 5, 2006 16:07:

Religion is sometimes the only comfort people have in times like this. It’s not something I would knock.

Santi said on August 5, 2006 17:43:

In any case, the main problem with this call is not the “positive feeling” which can be as useless as anyone can think. I have nothing against that.
The problem is how religion predates on the good will and the good feeling of people and makes them “religious” by definition. I think that is extremely unfair and that’s my problem with this thread.
Of course I hope those innocent children don’t suffer and that there are no wars and all that. Everyone wants that, because we don’t like suffering and we don’t like to see people suffering and we don’t want to know that people is suffering. And I hope the suffering ends.
But here it comes that for wanting that we must “pray” or “say a prayer”. Well, no, that’s wrong. I can share their grieve without the need of a prayer, and it’s not fair that if I don’t pray I may be left out of the feeling. And that’s what I feel now.

And certain religions (especially Christian and Islamic religions) prey on this feelings and take advantage of the good things they never defended in the first term, but that they’ve found that brings new “customers” in, so they use it.
I’ll talk on Christianity because being raised Catholic is what I know better:

There you have for example the Christmas, which is a celebration stolen from pagan rites all accross Europe (of the winter solstice... if you care), but now the Christian version has gained such a big popularity that in many parts of the world they don’t even know the Church made the birth of Jesus fit with the date.
There you have the missions in third world countries that go in the name of the church but are ready to bring new world technology based on the science the church has always despised. Obviously, the only way they have to show off that the Christian beliefs are superior is by their superior technology, so the people from those countries accept better that is superior and they give in...
And there you have the calls for prayers. Excuse me but my hope and those prayers do exactly the same... and if not... How many people does you God need praying to stop this suffering and others that don’t make the news??

kachina008 said on August 6, 2006 07:46:

I think it is unfortunate that this topic has turned from a call for positivity to a debate about religion *glares at Santi* But I can understand his point as well... “A call for prayer” is definitely rather insulting to non-religious people; it’s as if only the religiuos people can make a difference because they have this connection with God and the rest can’t make any sort of difference in any way. Still I don’t think that the person who started this thread had this intention...In my opinion it’s just the way (religious?) people think. The real question is, How will praying/thought/positivity stop Hezbollah or the Israeli army from firing rockets at each other? In my mind it is similar to people questionng the G8 concerts and how it will make any kind of difference with world poverty and hunger. If anything, the high level of positivity that I saw during the concerts was staggering, but how does it help put food into the mouth of a starving child?????

Personally I think it is highly arrogant of all of us to sit in our comfortable homes and pray/send posivity/spare one thought for the children dying in the war and then sit back and think “well now, I’ve done my part, it’s all I can do.” The people I admire the most are not the ones praying for the conflict to end, but the ones who risk their lives to go into ground zero and help children who are bombed out of their homes and lives. I interviewed a doctor who went within 3 days after the tsunami hit Indonesia to help the people, and people like him are the real heros. naturally not everyone of us can do this, and the whole world structure is corrupt enough that even if we give someone some money, there is no guarentee that it will ever reach the people who need it the most. I agree with Santi, God has nothing to do with this. We have created this situation ourselves and it is up to us to dig ourselves out of it. God is probably sitting there laughing at our absolute folly.

I agree with Nate about the power of the concentration of the mind while one is praying, but again, that is a very personal experience that you have with what you believe in. How a concentration of the power of the mind is supposed to bring about peace in the world is (I’m sorry to say) beyond me. And Nate, I think you really shouldn’t try to defend your faith to us. Your belief is your personal thing. Unfortunately there are many many many people whose lives have been ruined by religion rather than benefit from it, so I’d say your reputation as a Christian preceeds you. I’d say it isn’t worth trying to defend thousands of years of wrong doing. I’m sure you are a wonderful person with nothing but the desire to do good, still, I still say your faith is yours alone. It’s like trying to defend yourself when people make fun of you because you like Roxette :P I love Roxette, it’s my personal thing and I don’t have to explain myself to anybody.

It’s the curse of the highly developed world that is rich and people live in high excess while other people in developing countries are dying, of whatver it is, war, hunger, poverty. It is absolutely unfortunate the the politicians who control the money, food and everything are from the superpowers. And there is a huge gap between the public and these politicians. It’s like an embarrasment of riches, and reminds me of the end of the days of the Roman empire. I’m sure it’s going to topple as well just as dramatically.

kachina008 said on August 6, 2006 11:01:

and is in fact one of the regions which is most unstable due to war. makes you think, doesn’t it?

LittleSpooky said on August 6, 2006 19:37:

No it doesn’t.